>  I often accuse myself of being too simplistic about things (not
> ALWAYS a bad thing

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> ), but wouldn't it be pretty easy to simply add these extra fields
> to the database NOW, and at least allow that information to be
> entered, and viewed, through the "Manage Subscribers" -> View and
> Add sections?

Well, no. If I *just* do that, you have this hobbled feature and just
from experience, I will get a deluge of people saying, "Hey, this is
cool, but it's unusable to me, until you do...*this*." Pick every
feature in Dada Mail and I get emails asking that.

So there's that - it won't be very useable. The other thing is, it's
not so easy to make. First off, there's three backends Dada Mail
supports - the PlainText backend is up in the air if it will even
support multiple fields (my vote is for it to not). That leaves MySQL
and Postgres. You need to implement the two different ways, test,
debug, optimize, etc.

This doesn't rule out the idea of releasing alpha/betas with limited
functionality - I'm all for it, and once this gets ramped up, you'll
get a deluge of releases with different features implemented.

That's great and all, but one of the reasons I release alpha/betas is
to get feedback and I get so precious little, it's hard to make
decisions about the future.

Stressful :)

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Justin Simoni

Dada Mail -  Write Once: Distribute Everywhere Software
url: http://mojo.skazat.com



On Apr 11, 2007, at 8:13 AM, Joe Rizza wrote:

>  I often accuse myself of being too simplistic about things (not
> ALWAYS a bad thing ), but wouldn't it be pretty easy to simply add
> these extra fields to the database NOW, and at least allow that
> information to be entered, and viewed, through the "Manage
> Subscribers" -> View and Add sections? I assume it would be just as
> easy to allow that information to be added in the subscription form
> as well. Any other fancy features, which I probably don't
> understand, could be added later, but at least that most basic
> framework would be in place.
>
> Certainly there are lots of reasons for multiple fields, but at the
> most basic level, you just want to know who is on your list, and
> the email only field doesn't provide that information. Extracting
> the rest of the information that is already in the database can be
> done manually until supported by Dada later on.
>
> Just my 2 cents.
>
> -Joe
>
> On 4/11/07, Dada Mail (Justin Simoni) < dada@PROTECTED> wrote:
> On Apr 10, 2007, at 2:26 PM, Rob Taylor wrote:
>
> > For those of us who contributed to the fund drive, I think it is
> > reasonable to ask for a little more than a wild guess.
>
> You have a good point. And I feel pretty horrible about having it
> take so long.
>
> > How do we
> > make this a priority? More development money? With a firm
> > deliverable date we would be willing to contribute more. It is
> > obviously a very big project.
>
> I'm sort of in a tight spot, since I'd rather not ask for any more
> money, without having something to show for the current fund drive -
> not that there hasn't been any work towards it, it's just all been,
> "under the hood" and that's not very exciting. The only sort of
> funding I'd probably accept is private funding - not another public
> fundraising drive.
>
> That *is* a problem I've been currently been facing - how to make it
> a priority. Right now, there's, just in the development of Dada Mail,
> a few things I still have to do -
>
> First is to make sure the program's bugs are fixed and any security
> problems are dealt with. If you want to see what's currently open in
> the 2.10.13 release, check out:
>
>         https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=13002&atid=113002
>
> There's about 10 bugs currently for just that release.
>
> There's a whole bunch of things that people can do to help with that
> - namely, if you discover something - anything that's wrong with the
> program, file it as a bug. If it doesn't get filed, I never know
> about it. Honestly.
>
> The second is getting existing features working better. For example,
> the current moderation system for Dada Mail is severely broken - it's
> one of the reasons why messages take so long to appear from this
> group. There's also everyone's favorite pet project ;) (whatever that
> is) that they want worked on. I've put a list together of a few (if
> there are any others, let me know):
>
>          http://mojo.skazat.com/support/documentation/
> projects.pod.html
>
> Currently, I *mostly* do such projects for private commissions, since
> they're a lot of work to do for free ;) But, usually I still have to
> massage the feature and flesh it out so it's ready for public
> consumption. One example of that is the new queueing feature - the
> next feature release of Dada Mail will allow you to say how many
> mailouts you can have at one time - which is great! and will solve a
> lot of problems. The rub is, it's not totally complete, but the
> sponsor of the feature is satisfied. I still need to complete it out,
> test it out, etc. It's a killer feature though, and we'll be
> wondering how we all lived without it.
>
> Some of these features *did* take a higher priority than the multiple
> fields feature, for example the whole new sending monitor feature.
> Basically, a majority - a *majority* of mailouts of Dada Mail
> installs on shared hosts weren't completing. It made sense to make
> sure they would, before moving on. It was a difficult feature to put
> in, but now it's in, it's greatly beneficial.
>
> Another "feature", although not as glamorous is the start of the
> automated testing suite. I don't know how I could make such a drastic
> feature without it, now that it's in place. The Sending Monitor stuff
> wouldn't have been possible either, honestly. That's an ongoing
> project in of itself.
>
> Thankfully, these two things (bug fixes and new features) are in
> different branches in the code repository, so I'm not waiting for a
> feature to be completed before releasing a bug fixing release, as I
> used to (bone-headedly).
>
> The same will probably be done for the multiple fields, so we won't
> all have to wait for multiple fields to be done to get, say, the new
> mailout queueing feature. This alone will help things happen faster.
> This was a huge problem before, since I never was working on more
> than one branch at one time. Now that I understand how, I can work on
> as many branches as I want at one time.
>
> Anyways, back to you and Mariano's question of delivery date -
> probably time to start setting deadlines since, if none are ever set,
> time to set one.
>
> So, hopefully, I want to release a new alpha of 2.11 by next week (if
> not sooner). This release will have some new features I've been
> alluding too in past posts, as well as a blueprint of what needs to
> get done to get multiple fields in the program, as well as some docs
> on how to sync Dada Mail with Anything. Sync'ing Dada Mail with
> Anything is, itself a Killer Feature, since Dada Mail will never,
> ever be as feature rich in the content management side of things as
> something like Joomla (and conversely, Joomla will probably never be
> as feature rich in the mailing list department as Dada Mail).
>
>
> --
> Justin Simoni
>
> Dada Mail -  Write Once: Distribute Everywhere Software
> url: http://mojo.skazat.com
>
>
>
> On Apr 10, 2007, at 2:26 PM, Rob Taylor wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > For those of us who contributed to the fund drive, I think it is
> > reasonable to ask for a little more than a wild guess. How do we
> > make this a priority? More development money? With a firm
> > deliverable date we would be willing to contribute more. It is
> > obviously a very big project.
> >
> > I like the idea of integrating Dada with Joomla and would be happy
> > to work on a component based on your spec. We are also in the
> > situation where clients are demanding multi-field functionality.
> >
> > Thanks for your work on this.
> >
> > --
> > // Rob Taylor
> > \\ <Producer> TD Media
> > // http://www.tdmedia.com
> > \\ 760.438.9393
> > --
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Hi Justin,
> >>
> >> don't get mad at me for asking, but... do you have an estimate date
> >> for the multiple fields thingie working?
> >>
> >> I've been off the list for some time... the only dada
> installation I
> >> have is old and working perfectly (if it ain't broke, don't fix
> it),
> >> but now I'm being asked to set up one in which they need to have
> >> additional info for each address and I'd like to know if you
> have an
> >> estimate for this long awaited feature (we're talking weeks,
> months,
> >> years or, as usual, we don't know).
> >>
> >> I can live with a wild guess date and won't complain if you don't
> >> meet
> >> that... hey, I'm used to debian's release cicle :-D
> >>
> >> Regards.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Mariano Absatz - El Baby
> >> el (dot) baby (AT) gmail (dot) com
> >> el (punto) baby (ARROBA:@) gmail (punto) com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
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> >
> >
> >
> >
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> --
> -Joe
>
> joe@PROTECTED
> http://www.scubajoe.net/
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